Open Thread Non-Petroleum, June 25, 2022 

Ovi Uncategorized

A guest post by Ovi

Comments not related to oil or natural gas production in this thread please, thanks.

123 thoughts to “Open Thread Non-Petroleum, June 25, 2022 ”

    1. It’s still cleaner than just burning the coal to generate electricity for direct consumption.

    2. HinH .
      We all know you are a confused person, and also specialize in fact diversion (a form of propaganda)

      Just to be clear- the purpose of Photovoltaics is to generate electricity.
      The fact that their lifetime net CO2 emissions is also the lowest of any other form of energy production is a secondary attribute.

      Try to not be such a champion of the idiot mind.
      Big fonts don’t make you look smart, just even more desperate for attention.

      1. I’ve been praying for an enlarged prostate to stop the flow from this dick. Yet continue to see constant dribble. If there was a god, he could do so much better.

        1. Yes…I have realized that he is not an idiot,
          but sure plays the role of one exceedingly well.

        2. WTF? Lost my dad to prostate cancer and I’ve had it myself. Is this some sort of sick joke? Prostatitis is one of the most insidious diseases a man can have. It’s pain that just doesn’t go away no matter what.

          1. MADELINE Is a typical Biden Bro. Here calling one’s political opponents Nazis and wishing terminal illness upon them is the style. I’m surprised it’s tolerated at all.

            1. White Supremacy, Nazism, and the Republican Party

              By Jaimee A. Swift October 19, 2017

              This past summer, hundreds of white supremacists and neo-Nazis mobilized in Charlottesville, Virginia to prove a point — that they were always here and were here to stay.

              With anti-Semites, fascists, and racists gathering at the “Unite the Right” rally on the University of Virginia’s campus and racial tensions flaring between white supremacists and counter-protesters, many reactions to the racist violence at Charlottesville were of disgust and sadness.

              Like Trump, Presidents Ronald Reagan and George Bush, Sr., were aware of the Nazis and white supremacists within the GOP and, rather than condemning them, knowingly welcomed them into the Republican Party in an effort to fight communism. Many of those Nazis welcomed into the GOP would join the Republican Heritage Groups Council, a group whose members were “displaced fascists” who immigrated from Eastern and Central Europe to the United States after World War II

              In 1952, the Republican National Committee would establish an “Ethnic Division” and in 1969, the Republican Groups Heritage Council was formed with Axis allies, apologists, and pro-Nazi supporters as integral members of the Council’s leadership. The Council’s founding chair, Laszlo Pasztor, during World War II “was a leader of the youth group of the Arrow Cross, the Hungarian equivalent of the German Nazi Party.”

              With about twenty-five ethnic groups comprising the Republican Groups Heritage Council, two groups were not represented: Black and Jewish. Here, with the obvious exclusion of these groups, it should be no surprise that one of the Council’s political objectives was to eliminate the Office of Special Investigations (OSI), the anti-Nazi and hate crimes unit of the Justice Department.

              Reagan, Bush and other GOP leaders knew about these racist elements within their Party and even encouraged their participation. In 1985, Reagan, during a Heritage Council meeting, said:

              The work of all of you has meant a very great deal to me personally, to the Party and to our cause…I can’t think of any others who have made a more visible contribution to the effort than those of you who are in this room today…. I want to encourage you to keep building the Party. Believe me, bringing more ethnic Americans into the fold is the key to the positive realignment that we are beginning to see take shape.

              https://www.aaihs.org/white-supremacy-nazism-and-the-republican-party/

              Jaimee A. Swift is a Ph.D candidate at Howard University. Her research focuses on how Afro-Brazilian women activists counter racialized-gendered state-sanctioned violence and LGBTQ violence in Salvador da Bahia, Brazil

  2. Hint:
    Twenty-one states with fewer total people than California have 42 Senate seats.

      1. Turns out it’s three tanks, not one, total amount 2500 gallons, above ground installation.
        I don’t know how many heated buildings are on the property, but I’m guessing half a dozen or more.

        If so, this would be a more or less typical installation in terms of using propane for heat that far north.

        If you have large tanks, you don’t run out in a pinch if deliveries are interrupted by storms or labor strikes, etc.

        It seems to me that speculating about the USE of propane at a residence is the nothing more nor less than simple trolling.

        1. OFM
          I do not live in the USA, so if you say that is a normal and typical installation for that region, good enough for me.
          I do tend to track the activities of people I consider to have access to private, high quality information about what is coming down the road at us as their actions can reflect what they know.
          A few years ago, while on vacation in Northern Italy I was fascinated by local history recounting the passage of huge entourages of rich families from Rome passing through on their way to presumed safe destinations where they could continue their lifestyle. They were right about Rome, but there does not seem to be any record that their moves worked out well for them.

      2. Your are correct that the wealthy will not be constrained by the same energy scarcity that most people will.
        Just as it has always been.

        Some people will still fly, while others can’t even get a bit of fertilizer,
        some will go on pleasure or cruise boat while others can’t heat their home,
        some will take a pleasure drive while others walk ten miles to get some cooking wood.

        And yes, whoever can will get solar or propane or coal or wood for their house or for their business.
        Shouldn’t be surprising.

  4. Fritz Haber Is possibly the epitome of tragic irony. He is often credited with being ultimately responsible for allowing the majority of today’s population to be fed and, therefore, could also be blamed for causing more absolute suffering and environmental destruction than any other individual. He was a patriotic jew who originated chemical warfare to help German war efforts but his work eventually led to the production and use of Zyklon B and his life was blighted and destroyed by the Nazis. He was an absentee husband and father and his wife, herself a brilliant chemist but also a pacifist and early feminist, killed herself with his gun in the First World War. Even had he not existed someone would have invented nitrogen fixation early last century, possibly his wife who, had she not married and given birth, would have been free to pursue her career, and then we’d now have the Immerwahr-Bosch process. Such is the obligatory nature of technological progress: it has to be pursued and the discoveries have to be used whatever their ultimate consequences may be.

    1. Haber is possibly the most destructive human to ever live, and domed our race.
      But, as pointed out, it would of happened anyway.

        1. Hint:
          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clara_Immerwahr
          “condemned her husband’s weapons work as a “perversion of the ideals of science” and “a sign of barbarity, corrupting the very discipline which ought to bring new insights into life.”
          And:
          the father of chemical warfare.

          “In 1914, as Director of the Kaiser Wilhelm Institute for Physical Chemistry, Haber placed his laboratory at the service of the German government, and by April of 1915, he was on the front lines in Ypres, in uniform, smoking cigars and calculating the timing of what he hoped would be a lethal gas attack. Thousands of steel cylinders containing chlorine gas had been transported to German positions. There would be no launching or dropping of the gas on Allied troops; instead, Haber calculated, the best delivery system was the prevailing winds in Belgium. After weeks of waiting for ideal winds—strong enough to carry the gas away from the German troops, but not so strong they would dissipate the gas weapons before they could take effect against the enemy—the Germans released more than 168 tons of chlorine gas from nearly 6,000 canisters at sunrise on April 22. A sickly cloud, one witness told the New York Times, “like a yellow low wall,” began to drift toward the French trenches.

          The cloud settled over some 10,000 troops. More than half were believed to have died by asphyxiation within minutes.”

          1. And the irony of the story was Haber was a Jew, creating a chemical weapon, a poison gas, for a nation that would, just two decades later, try to kill all Jews with poison gas. I agree with you. He was a Nobel laureate and a despicable human being.

    1. Thanks! I love finding new works like this. “Blip” was a great read.

    1. Very interesting, thanks for the link. Have you read The Ministry for the Future? It describes several responses to the hyper threats. One being continuous swathes of land that are returned to the wild and off limits to humans.

      1. Texas, Oklahoma, Louisiana, Mississippi, Arkansas, Missouri, Kansas, Kentucky, Tennessee
        would be a good start.
        Lets enact it before the 2024 vote, please.

        1. Just for 500 years or so—–
          All the bad toxins should start to wash away by then.

        2. I feel those states will likely begin to experience a ‘brain drain’; that is to say, folks with the brighter ideas & the resources to do so will get to better ground. The number one rule of survival is ‘find a better place to hangout’. The population bottleneck will likely not select for sentimentality.

          1. “those states” have been experiencing this for decades, how do you think they—and we— got to the condition we’re in? It’s not for nothing that the folks left behind feel left behind.

            “…migration of America’s most educated citizens to a handful of states and cities has created a “winner-take-all” geographic divide between talent magnets and communities left behind.”
            https://apnews.com/article/business-441602f95c749333e79085a8d7b1e3e9

            1. Thanks for that. Interesting (but not surprising). Humans are tribal and like to be with people like themselves…
              The practical problem is that the mismatch between geographical concentration and the 1787 “Great compromise” ( 2 senators per state regardless of population) gets bigger and bigger.
              rgds
              WP

        3. Hi Hickory.
          Keep in mind migrants from those states would end up in your neck of the woods…and some of them vote.

    1. Failed states often are contagious, via migration waves and terrorism.

      1. Failed states
        “People have yet to grasp that control of the Supreme Court effectively trumps the Executive Branch and the Legislative Branch. Six unelected Justices with lifetime appointments and zero accountability for their actions are now calling the shots. Established law is now out; precedents and historic practices are irrelevant. “

        1. Indeed.
          When will you need to document your digital PPVAR
          [Proper Prayer and Voting Activity Record]
          in order to avoid the federal Social Penalty Tax?
          2026?

          1. Will the PPVAR have the ability to record prayer session other than christian? And if not, which particular flavor of christianity will be acceptable?
            /s
            Rgds
            WP

            1. Of course only Christian.
              You will lose points even for asking, and your credit rating and energy ration will be penalized. Wise up.

              Which version- The Party Platform v2024 of course.

              Don’t expect me to be around for long.
              I don’t handle even mild coercion too well.
              And I don’t engage in prayer.
              Compassionate thought yes. Prayer no.

    1. Both of the articles lay out the idea that mass migrations can or should be handled humanely and that root causes must be addressed.
      Its a good notion, but I fear that we are in store for witnessing episodes where borders get swamped in a massive way. And in those situations human behavior will fail to handle the situation well, even if such a thing was possible.
      Mass migration under extreme duress is an inevitable aspect of population overshoot.

      And yes, my spirit weeps to see/know this.

      From the first-
      “There is no nationalist solution to a climate crisis where carbon emissions and global heating know no borders. Militarised adaptation to climate breakdown is akin…to the politics of the ‘armed lifeboat’ that seeks to secure the wealth of the few while training guns on everyone else. In the end, by failing to tackle the root causes of the climate crisis, even the armed lifeboat is likely to sink.”

      Well, militarized adaptation is what is going to happen, and climate instability is just one of the risks.

      1. The activities going on at the Melilla-Morocco border fence seem a good example of what’s perhaps in store for Mexico’s southern border with Central America, and USA’s with Mexico.

  10. Wow – I gotta stay out of these off-topic pages…way too efffing depressing over here…

    I’ll go back to the petroleum related posts…

    1. “western civilization would be a good idea”

      I see your point—-

  11. Anyone following this hell going on in the travel industry across many countries now? Flights cancelled, no services at airports, hotel prices through the roof. Just a lot of frustration for people trying to get where they need to go on vacation. Seems like a collapse scenario to me.

    2. Hopefully travel industry downsizing will rapidly accelerate over the coming decade or two.
      Most flying is entirely optional, and it all is an attack on nature.
      Flying will once again shift from being occasionally affordable by those in middle classes of the world
      to only being affordable by wealthier people who can throw money at
      the extravagant act despite a world overrun by humanity and energy poverty for most.

    1. She listed three things in one frame, Population Bomb, Peak Oil, and New Ice Age. That last one was thrown in just to make the other two look silly. There was, for a short time many years ago, a small number of people talking about a new ice age. But it didn’t get a lot of attention. She should have not included that at all.

      The population bomb and peak oil have another explanation. The population bomb was big in the 1970s. The prediction of catastrophic consequences was accurate, just way too early. They will come in this century, not the 20th century. The peaking of peak oil production was also too early, but only by about 15 years.

      Because these two predictions did not pan out in the time frame predicted, people now think they were both a big hoax. They believe the population bomb is no problem whatsoever and peak oil will never come. That is just a flaw in the reasoning power of the average human. Human reasoning power is flawed in a few places.

      Sabine Hossenfelder is a physicist and cosmologist. She is very good at that, I have watched perhaps a dozen of her YouTube videos. But she doesn’t know shit about the consequences of population overshoot or peak oil. She should just leave these two subjects alone.

      I started to reply to that video but there were already over a hundred replies, so I didn’t bother.

      1. Thanks for replying, Ron. I agree with you. As Dr. Bartlett has famously said (tongue-in-cheek, of course), “The calculation must’ve been wrong; therefore, of course, all calculations are wrong.”

        1. Ron and Mike B,

          Yes these physicists just don’t understand mathematics at all. 🙂

          1. Dennis, the destruction of the natural world hasn’t a damn thing to do with mathematics. The concept of overshoot cannot be explained by mathematics. Mathematics cannot tell us how much oil is left in the ground.

            I am a great fan of Sabine Hossenfelder. She is one of the most brilliant cosmetologist I have ever watched on YouTube and I have watched presentations of almost all that have made videos. But she is definitely outside her discipline when it comes to population overshoot or peak oil.

            And Dennis, it shows a bit of naivete on your part to think these two subjects can be explained entirely by mathematics.

            1. Ron,

              Physicists can understand other disciplines pretty well with a little reading of experts on the subject, though they would know less than the specialists in those fields.

              Many climate scientists have a geophysics background and geophysics helps a lot with understanding peak oil, probably less so with demographics, but there are many demographers that think the Population bomb was alarmist.

            2. I understand that Sabine Hossenfelder knows one hell of a lot more about cosmology than I do. I also understand that she does not know dick shit about population overshoot or peak oil. Just to brush them off like they are both nonsenses like she did as if both subjects were not worth spending more time on, speaks volumes about her knowledge of the two subjects.

              I understand Dennis, that you agree with her, especially on population overshoot, or the population bomb as she referred to it. But you both are wrong and claiming that an eminent cosmologist agrees with you, does not make your argument any stronger.

              However Sabine Hossenfelder agrees with me on one very important point. She agrees that the multiverse theory is total bullshit. That is one smart girl when it comes to cosmology.

              Why the multiverse is religion, not science.

            6. “With or without religion, good people can behave well and bad people can do evil; but for good people to do evil – that takes religion.” ~ Steven Weinberg, theoretical physicist

            7. Sure it can. Try fitting infinity into a finite integer. That’s all the maths you need to explain the current world predicament.

              Exponential growth works until it doesn’t. That part is now.

      2. Many physicists have a big history of allowing their beliefs intrude upon their scientific thinking in a very big way.
        And they have ‘lay person’ level of understating on issues they have not studied up on, just like everyone else. Such as on energy supply or population dynamics.

        https://theconversation.com/a-long-fuse-the-population-bomb-is-still-ticking-50-years-after-its-publication-96090

        tsunami wave have a long lead up. this population one is still building towards a peak

    2. Ehrlich wasn’t wrong about population, although birth control has slowed growth. But he was really wrong about agriculture. He thought farming was at its peak productivity back when. Turns out the one-shot expenditure of fossil oil/gas, fossil water, and fossil soil, along with new genetics, has increased ag productivity 200%.

      But because humans don’t believe in limits, the problem—the population— doubled as well. Only now THAT 4 billion people aren’t just depending on ag for food, they are depending solely on FOSSIL agriculture because it is the reason they haven’t starved yet.

      But when the fossils are gone, so are they.

  14. Little known fact: Southern California used to have one of the countries biggest lakes. Like the Aral Sea in Central Asia, it was wrecked by dumb land use and massively subsidized farming.

    https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Tulare_Lake

    Now it is turning into a desert.

  15. Global sea ice area and extent have been setting daily minimums for the last few days. Antarctic extent has been at a minimum and area nearly so. Arctic sea ice is in the lowest ten for both extent and area. June loss in coverage has been the highest recorded, just beating out 2012 which went on to set the all time low record in September. A lot is made that early melt momentum leads to later low records, I’m not sure there’s enough data to see trends and conditions change every year as the Arctic transitions to ice free summer conditions. At the moment the ice is being clobbered by high atmospheric heat on the Pacific side, a series of lows, which might block the sun but churn up and disperse thin ice, can draw in warm air and may have rain associated, and some local phenomena that produce heavy dews or fog (which can be particularly destructive as the local heat of condensation – 2260 J/g – can go directly into melting the ice – 334 J/g, so one gram of dew/mist can melt 6 to 7 of ice). I think new daily lows and possibly an all time low are on the cards.

    https://cryospherecomputing.com
    https://sites.uci.edu/zlabe/arctic-sea-ice-figures/

  16. LINKS BETWEEN METHANE AND CLIMATE CHANGE REVEALED

    Using data gathered over the last four decades to study the effects of temperature changes and rain on the atmospheric concentration of methane, a NTU Singapore team concluded that the Earth could be both delivering more, and removing less, methane into the air than previously estimated, with the result that more heat is being trapped in the atmosphere. This impact could be four times greater than that estimated in the latest Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) report.

    The study, published in the scientific journal Nature Communications on 23 June, addresses the large uncertainty about the impact of climate change on atmospheric methane.

    https://phys.org/news/2022-06-reveals-powerful-links-methane-climate.html

    1. The real nice thing about methane is that it’s very reactive. To add to that, most laymen like you without science degrees are aware in some sense that methane is combustible, but let me explain to you how an educated scientist would approach the situation. That reactivity means methane breaks down inside the atmosphere at a much faster rate than other greenhouse gases. While carbon dioxide takes decades to break down, the same amount of methane takes less than a year.

      1. Methane half life in the atmosphere is roughly 8 years.
        Despite that the concentration in the atmosphere has more than doubled since mankind got industrial.
        indicating that accumulation is much more rapid than decline.
        And it has potent warming affect.

      2. HENRY —

        The half-life of methane is 9.1 years in the atmosphere. My degrees are Engineering Physics, Geology and Geophysics. Per the paper I cited, the latest figures from the United States’ National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration show that the amount of methane in the atmosphere reached historic highs in 2020 and 2021 and is currently increasing at its fastest recorded rate.

        1. Thanks for coming out DL. Always a pleasure to read your comments and then feel better informed for having done so.

        2. And doesn’t CH4 have something like 84 times the heat-trapping impact over the short term?

          1. Mike —

            Indeed it does. I should have mentioned that fact. Thanks.

    1. The Church apparently is not interested in climate change (or population overshoot).

      btw- 6 out of 9 are Popes men, and a 7th Gorsuch was raised Catholic but does not make his allegiance clear (except through his voting)

      1. Cabbages For Christ are not the brightest porch lights on the block.

        1. And than there are those who’s porch light is burned out. That don’t know the difference from right and left, who vote useless.

          Republicans wet dream

          Abortion illegal, merge church and state, check
          Climate change, uncontrolled pollution for profit, check
          Fascism and Authoritarianism, check
          Gerrymandered and thousand year reign, check

          The Nazis are here

          1. Vote Blue No Matter Who

            https://www.theonion.com/vote-blue-no-matter-who-vote-blue-no-matter-who-cha-1842237379/amp

            If not voting for the Dims
            Is the same as a vote for the repugs,
            Then not voting for the Repugs
            Is the same as a vote for the Dims.

            3rd Party 2024!

            Ranked-Choice Voting and the Potential for Improved Electoral Performance of Third-Party Candidates in America
            “Proponents of ranked-choice voting highlight a number of arguments for why such an approach to elections should be adopted. One major argument is that ranked-choice voting will encourage voters to support more third-party or independent candidates and break the electoral stranglehold of the two main parties in America. Considering approximately two-thirds of Americans want a third major party this argument may prove appealing to American voters”
            https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/1532673X211072388?journalCode=aprb

            Representation of Third-Party and Independent Voters
            https://www.fairvote.org/third_party_and_independent_representation

            Why The Two-Party System Is Effing Up U.S. Democracy
            “when partisans see their political opposition not just as the opposition, but as a genuine threat to the well-being of the nation, support for democratic norms fades because “winning” becomes everything”
            https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-the-two-party-system-is-wrecking-american-democracy/amp/

            FWIW- I view both the Dims and the Repugs as a genuine threat to the well-being of the nation, and indeed to the mental health of those who too seriously entertain their unpersuasive arguments.

            1. Survivalist-
              When a race is down to 2 people, no matter what the parties are called,
              you either make a decision, or
              in effect you are allowing someone who may be a whole less savvy than you make the choice for you.

              By not voting you are in essence just making a fashion statement, allowing you say
              ‘heck- I’m not responsible for this mess since I wasn’t dumb enough to vote for either’.
              Great for your self-esteem (if that is what charges it up), but you still got the winner determined by others to live with.

          2. Well said Madeline.

            Survivalist. I disagree with your approach, similar to my reaction to many of my friends who lean hard progressive when it comes to voting.
            I may agree with your, and their, ideals.
            But I am voting for the practical results, not ideals.
            For issues like human rights, separation of church and state, energy policy, and the supreme court for example.
            On a whole slew of important issues the R and D’s are like night and day.
            You might not like either one but then choosing the lesser bad is an easy choice compared to getting the worse result forced down your throat by others.

            In this real world we don’t get to fabricate our ideal governing result.
            We have to work with what choices are actually present, and viable.

            1. I just vote for the Party/politician with the policies that I like the most. I thought that was the point. Dims might catch a second place of me in ranked choice voting.

            2. Pissing into the wind

              Undertaking a task in such a way as to make undesirable consequence to yourself likely, when avoiding those consequences would have been easily achieved by a simple change in direction or approach. (i.e., pissing down wind instead.)

              Curious, what are your top three complaints, fears, genuine threat to the well-being of the nation by the Democrats ?

              Was the Nazi Party a threat to Germany in the 20’s and 30’s ?

            3. Hi HB, Is the GOP the Nazis now? Check your history; you might find that something other than ‘vote blue no matter who’ needs to be done in order to rid ones self of Nazis. There’s a few books on it. I could introduce you to some antifascist street fighting outfits if you’re keen to join in on antagonizing Proud Boys and Patriot Prayer types every time they leave Facebook for a meet-up In Real Life; got the minerals? Generally speaking, though, Lefties don’t argue for very long with the types of people that John Brown would have murdered. Fascism is fought in the street, it’s a bottom-up thing; as opposed to conservative authoritarianism, which is more top down, and what you’re likely on about with this Nazi hype.

              Why The Two-Party System Is Effing Up U.S. Democracy
              “when partisans see their political opposition not just as the opposition, but as a genuine threat to the well-being of the nation, support for democratic norms fades because “winning” becomes everything”
              https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/why-the-two-party-system-is-wrecking-american-democracy/amp/

              The Democrats Aren’t a Left-Wing Party — They Just Play One on TV
              https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/07/are-democrats-too-liberal-debates-pelosi-congress.html

              The net-zero Dark Ages: Democrats’ war on the poor
              https://thehill.com/opinion/energy-environment/3506079-the-net-zero-dark-ages-democrats-war-on-the-poor/amp/

              I feel it takes quite a bit more cognitive dissonance to be a Dim politician than to be a Repug politician. The Repugs are quite straight up about how they, IMHO, wish to fuck most folks over, and then proceed to do so when elected. The Dims campaign on equitable policies and lament wealth concentration, and then when elected do nothing at all but advance their own interests.

              Enjoy the famine. Once voting blue no matter who fails to solve the problem, perhaps try eating your lawn. I recommend tinned gravy & hot sauce.

  19. I just sent the following email to my three sons.

    “I am within one week of finishing my book. It will be only 85 to 90 pages long. It will take me another week to go over it word per word to eliminate errors. Then I will send it to the publisher. I am hiring another review to make sure everything is ok. That will cost me 500 bucks over the publishing cost, which will be about 2 grand. I really don’t give a shit about that, it is just money and I have it to leave when I die. It will probably be a month or two from that date before it appears on Amazon. But it will go out to all book markets, not just Amazon.

    I don’t expect to make a dime from it. In fact, I will not get back even half the money I put into getting it published because I intend to price it at just a few dollars. Less than three dollars on kindle and three to four dollars for paperback. I just want to get it into as many hands as possible.

    I am really excited about it. It is all I can think about recently. It will be the last important thing I will ever do.

    I expect you to read it and give me five stars on Amazon. 🤣”

    Love you all,

    Dad

    2. Looking forward to it! If you can, please make it available as pdf too. Thanks.

    3. Hi Ron,
      I want an autographed copy.

      Please post something here telling all your old timer followers and friends how to get it.

      OFM

    4. I remember you saying a long time ago that the subject involves evolution. In which case I want one!

      1. Putin’s plan is to shift everything to China and India.

        Then he will go down in history as the guy who gave NATO one in the #2.

        Putin has been mucking around in Syria for a decade or more.

        What value does Syria have for Putin?

        It prevents NATO ( USA, France, UK…oil importers) from stealing the Oil in the Middle East and bypassing the Strait of Hormuz via the Meditteranean Sea.

        It is safe to assume the Militaries of the World are Peak Oil aware.

        After all, the oil embargo is strategy day #1.

        1. Putin’s plan is to shift everything to China and India.
          Russia is making 800 Million Dollars a day by petroleum exports to Europe.
          But agree, this Fall they may pull the trigger.

        2. What value does Syria have for Putin?

          Syria perhaps makes an ideal terminus for Iranian South Pars/North Dome gas, that can then be sent on to Turkey or Greece, or whoever grovels most, I suppose, but wtf do I know. I would also imagine that getting one’s hands on those transit fees on natural gas going to Europe is worth a few quid.
          As well, it’s perhaps worth noting, many of Syria’s military officers were trained in part in Russia, speak Russian, and have indeed married Russians. Russia sells Syria a lot of kit and offers security guarantees. There is a Russian Material-Technical Support Point/naval facility in Tartus.
          When much of MENA was up in arms about the Arab spring, and USA was abandoning its dictator in Egypt to be jailed by the Muslim Brotherhood, Russia felt it important to stand behind their dictator in Syria, I guess. I feel that Russia also used Syria to showcase a lot of kit, which was likely good for sales.

          https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Client_state

          Iran–Iraq–Syria pipeline
          https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran–Iraq–Syria_pipeline

          Infographic: Which countries buy the most Russian weapons?
          https://www.aljazeera.com/amp/news/2022/3/9/infographic-which-countries-buy-the-most-russian-weapons

          1. Interesting.

            When I simply look at a map. It appears that Syria is the key to flow OIL thru the Meditteanean Sea.

            That would greatly benefit NATO if it was pulled off ( alot of uncertainty there).

            The Strait of Hormuz is looking more perilous by the day.

            Syria is the poop chute of the Med Sea

            1. To put it mildly, I’m no expert, but I suspect the big ticket item is natural gas, not oil. Europe needs gas, Iran has shit loads in South Pars/North Dome Gas. A pipeline of it going to Syria via Iraq is quite desirable to some. From Syria natural gas could perhaps be piped and/or LNG’d to Europe?

              Iran-Iraq-Syria Friendship Pipeline could consolidate Greece as an energy hub
              https://greekcitytimes.com/2021/02/20/iran-iraq-syria-friendship-pipeline/

              Can you imagine, Greece an energy hub? That would flip Northern and Southern Europe on its head.

              Why Syria Is A Critical Part Of Russia’s Energy Strategy
              https://oilprice.com/Geopolitics/Middle-East/Why-Syria-Is-A-Critical-Part-Of-Russias-Energy-Strategy.amp.html

            2. Strait of Hormuz?

              “more than a fifth of global oil supply flowing through”

              While Syria’s position is interesting, reality does trump ideology.

            3. Militaries can’t change geography or geology.

              This is what we have to work with.

              I emphasize this has been planned for a LONG time.

              No one could know when peak oil would happen exactly.

              Please consider how expensive and tasking these Miltary operations are.

              Just setting up in Syria for fun…Makes no sense at all unless there is a compelling reason

            4. I would imagine Europe’s thirst for natural gas will soon reach south pars/north dome. From what I understand it has been proposed that Iranian natural gas can be shipped to European markets via Persian Pipeline, Iran to Turkey, or via Iran–Iraq–Syria pipeline.

              https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_Pipeline

              Pipeline transit fees on decades of Iranian natural gas to European markets seems, to some, to be well worth fighting over; perhaps make a billionaire out of a despot.

              I do think that ‘the Syrian situation’ is far more complex than Pepe Escobar’s Pipelineitan conspiracy theories, but it is an interesting angle.

              A Pipelineistan fable for our times
              https://asiatimes.com/2020/06/a-pipelineistan-fable-for-our-times/?amp_markup=1

              The ‘Pipelineistan’ conspiracy: The war in Syria has never been about gas
              https://www.middleeasteye.net/big-story/pipelineistan-conspiracy-war-syria-has-never-been-about-gas

              Pipelineistan’s New Silk Road
              “Chinese companies have invested a staggering $120 billion in Iran’s energy sector over the past five years. Already Iran is China’s number two oil supplier, accounting for up to 14% of its imports; and the Chinese energy giant Sinopec has committed an additional $6.5 billion to building oil refineries there.”
              https://www.outlookindia.com/website/story/pipelineistans-new-silk-road/267453/amp

            5. Natural Gas is what Europe does, percentage wise, depend on Russia for a significant supply.
              It could (probably) get real desperate this Fall and Winter, if Russia turns exports to India and China fully.

  21. I’ve been banging on the “alternative battery” drum for quite some time, pointing out that there are numerous ways to store otherwise surplus wind and solar electricity if only we get our act together and make use of them.

    https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/berlin-prepares-huge-thermos-heat-homes-winter-86001074

    This is such a use. I don’t know how well it will work, in terms of dollars or Euro’s per kilowatt hour saved, but it’s obviously going to help to a significant extent in reducing the need for gas for heat during the winter.

    I’m wondering if it’s not feasible to build and operate hot water farms in the summer, and pump it down to certain spots where it flows easily thru the water table, and pull up more to be heated, and pumped down again.

    If this could be done, as a practical matter, it would mean some cities could have AMPLE winter heat by way of ground sourced hot water for district heating, or ground sourced heat pumps, which would obviously work far more efficiently using hot water than cold air or relatively cold ground water.

    The plumbing could be very simple, in terms of placing hot water collectors for warm weather use on top of large buildings, along with solar panels of course. Such panels need next to nothing in the way of wiring…….. just a pump someplace nearby to push the cold water in and the hot water out.

    1. I recall hearing interesting things about Underground Molten Salt Thermal Energy Storage. Perhaps a dispersed network of energy collectors could centralize energy storage and produce molten salt for civic use.

      Molten-Salt Battery Freezes Energy Over a Whole Season
      “According to initial tests at the U.S. Pacific Northwest National Laboratory, a long-duration grid-scale battery can use energy stored during the spring to cool a house on a hot summer day.”
      https://spectrum.ieee.org/amp/long-term-energy-storage-molten-salt-2657159314

      Salt breakthrough could halve the cost of storing solar energy
      “Danish startup accidentally developed the solution while working on nuclear research”
      https://sifted.eu/articles/salt-energy-storage-seaborg-hyme/

  22. Plant a tree they say. Well, maybe not in Brazil.

    BRAZIL SETS NEW SIX-MONTH AMAZON DEFORESTATION RECORD

    Deforestation of the Brazilian Amazon reached a record level during the first half of 2022. The world’s largest tropical rainforest lost 3,750 square kilometers (1,450 square miles) of jungle since the beginning of the year, the worst numbers for that period since record-keeping began in 2016.

    https://phys.org/news/2022-07-brazil-six-month-amazon-deforestation.html

    1. Any of the talking heads here have a pov on when Brazilian agricultural production will begin to decline? My risk assessment has been quite focused on the issue of NH mid latitude temps, as that’s where most of the worlds food is grown. Although, I imagine that a good deal is also grown in the tropics, and the SH mid latitudes – although land seems scarce there.

      https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_latitudes#/media/File:World_map_temperate.svg

      “According to the IPCC, Brazil will experience an increase of 1.43 °C in the average temperature and a reduction of 1.44 per cent in rainfall in the period from 2030 to 2049, which our simulations suggest will reduce the agricultural productivity by 18 per cent”
      https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/environment-and-development-economics/article/climate-change-and-agricultural-productivity-in-brazil-future-perspectives/0BD4A1035BC0ED1B3399DC5782D10CB0

      Effects of tropical deforestation on climate and agriculture
      “Future agricultural productivity in the tropics is at risk from a deforestation-induced increase in mean temperature and the associated heat extremes and from a decline in mean rainfall or rainfall frequency”
      https://www.nature.com/articles/nclimate2430

      “we are getting to the “knee point”, or curve inflection in the exponential rise in the rate of collapse of civilization. Those familiar with exponential curves will know what that means. For others, simply put, the poop has hit the fan and is now being distributed randomly throughout the room.” ~ George Mobus

      1. For the early signs watch the Cattinga region. It is already well into a desertification pattern.
        https://cepb.ngo/caatinga-biome-and-desertification/

        To one of your other points- southern Brazil and adjacent Uruguay, Paraguay and Argentina
        grow a lot of food and are major players on the international export market for soy, corn, beef, wheat.
        2020-
        3 of the top 4 in the world of exporters for soy are on that short list (add USA to get 4th and Canada to get 5th)

        2 of the top 3 in the world for corn exports are on that short list (add USA to get the other in the top)

        Argentina number 7 of top wheat exporters

        2 of the top 5 world beef exporters are on that short list

        1. Cheers Hick. Great synopsis. Great food for thought. I’m quite keen on the Export Land Model as it applies to key food exports, as well as oil and natural gas exports.
          I suppose that as Brazil clears jungle for cattle and sugar cane, they will, in the short term, increase agricultural production. However, it seems that in the longer run it will suffer a contraction.
          Peak oil trends & climate chaos in the world’s farm belts is a harsh mistress.

    1. What the Supreme Court ruled the EPA can and can’t do

      A Thursday ruling by the Supreme Court significantly curtailed the Environmental Protection Agency’s power to restrict emissions from power plants under a 2014 rule, but the agency still retains other tools to curb emissions — for now.

      In the 6-3 ruling in West Virginia vs. EPA, the court’s conservative majority found that the EPA lacked the authority to enforce an Obama-era power plant rule without specific congressional approval.

      https://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/3544291-what-the-supreme-court-ruled-the-epa-can-and-cant-do/

      Now for those useless voters, who have difficulty understanding. Who live life dreaming about living in 3000 BC in the woods. The right is trying to dismantle the EPA and any regulations that limit CO2 emissions to increase corporate profits. While the left are trying to move technology and economy forward that will reduce CO2 emissions. You see, Republicans bad. Democrats good trying to limit CO2. Again, Republicans bad, Democrats good.

      Jill Stein, nowhere to be found, useless.

      1. Useless voters? I think more of the useless Democrats & Republicans. They seem to be accountable for much of America’s current predicament. They got us here. It is not the people who are not in power who are responsible for why we’re hear, so to speak.

        Jill hasn’t been on a ballot since 2016. What do you suppose she should be doing?

        Enjoy the famine. Histrionics won’t save you, or anyone else. Maybe try articulating a policy, or perhaps a persuasive argument; although, I suppose sometimes ad hominem and “argument by assertion” can’t be avoided, but you should try and include at least some actual reasoning.

          1. The primary options on the ballot, as far as I can detect, are Right Wing and Batshit Crazy Right Wing. No wonder so many don’t vote.

            Pro-Tip for the Biden Bros; “In non-RCV elections, candidates benefit from mudslinging and attacking their opponent instead of sharing their positive vision with voters. This can lead to increasingly toxic and polarizing campaigns.”
            https://www.fairvote.org/rcvbenefits

            Perhaps Democrats could share their positive vision with voters better in a campaign that is less toxic & polarizing? I don’t see how they couldn’t. And on that basis, Democrats should support RCV.

            Why Do Democrats Suck at Messaging?
            https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2022/06/why-do-democrats-suck-at-messaging/amp

          2. Very good Hightrekker, you have reduced the Russian doctrine of learned helplessness to terms Americans can understand. Make way for the dictatorship you crave.

      2. As Maddy has it, the Democrats are ‘the left’. That is a great example of Political Illiteracy. Most unpersuasive, and frankly absurd.

        “The worst illiterate is the political illiterate” ~ Bertolt Brecht

        https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_literacy

        “While the left are trying to move technology and economy forward that will reduce CO2 emissions. You see, Republicans bad. Democrats good trying to limit CO2. Again, Republicans bad, Democrats good.” ~ MADELINE HYANNISPORT

        It’s too bad Americans can’t show discipline & limit their own CO2, like an internal EPA in each citizens heart, if you will. But as it is, America doesn’t have those kinda people in large numbers.

        1. Survavalivst, you must know that the vast majority of people who post on this blog know that Trump and all Trumpites are blooming idiots who tried to destroy the constitution of the United States.

          I have no idea why you keep posting your right-wing fascist bullshit but just so you know that most of us here know only idiots believe that bullshit. So you are not raising your popularity level here by posting that bullshit.

    1. I believe it was 2010 when reading online about the Horizon disaster that brought me to finding The Oil Drum, if I’ve got my memory of the timeline correct. Life hasn’t been the same since.

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