74 thoughts to “Open Thread Non-Petroleum, October 8, 2020”

    2. Lets just come out and say it.
      When Trump said “Liberate Michigan” on April 17th,
      he did outright indicate support for domestic terrorism.

      No beating around the bush, its not complicated.
      To Liberate- “free (a country, city, or people) from enemy occupation”

      § 18.2-46.5. Committing, conspiring and aiding and abetting acts of terrorism prohibited; penalty.

      He is in deep shit come Jan 20th.

      1. Mike Cohen said that Trump’s normal mode of communication is that of a mob boss: indirect commands that can always be described as meaning something else. A way of life built around avoiding convictions based on FBI wiretaps…

        1. Ignorance (the trump acting president) is no defense, in court. Or in the forum of public opinion.

          1. The defense isn’t ignorance, it’s plain denial. “I never told anyone to do anything violent” or “I was just kidding”, and so on.

            And in court you need certainty beyond a reasonable doubt. In the court of public opinion, of course, you only need a willingness to follow dear leader.

            1. Sorry Nick. I my world of stark reality- he is guilty!
              Its not complicated.

              I’m not interested in his excuse of ignorance, or anyone else’s excuses, or equivocations.

  2. Looking for rare metals for batteries? Well, we can always mine the seafloor but….

    DEEP-SEABED MINING LASTINGLY DISRUPTS THE SEAFLOOR FOOD WEB

    An international team of scientists around Tanja Stratmann from the Max Planck Institute for Marine Microbiology in Bremen, Germany, and Utrecht University, the Netherlands, and Daniëlle de Jonge from Heriot-Watt University in Edinburgh, Scotland, has investigated the food web of the deep seafloor to see how it is affected by disturbances such as those caused by mining activities. They found significant long-term effects of the 1989 mining simulation experiment. The total throughput of carbon in the ecosystem was significantly reduced. “Especially the microbial part of the food web was heavily affected, much more than we expected.”

    https://phys.org/news/2020-10-deep-seabed-lastingly-disrupts-seafloor-food.html

  3. Its early days for smaller and cleaner transport. The industry is in an explosive phase of innovation. Very interesting is the small cargo/utility sector.
    The ability of local farmers to bring produce to market, for example, will be able to be accomplished even after oil is depleted or phased out. Living 10-20 miles from town will no longer be too far to function easily in a world will much less oil.
    Examples of the day-
    “Following a successful pilot across several cities, Amazon India has announced that by 2025, its delivery fleet will include 10,000 electric vehicles”.-
    https://electrek.co/2020/01/20/watch-jeff-bezos-drive-amazons-new-electric-rickshaw/

    “Motorbikes and three-wheel rickshaws are ubiquitous in the country, and India’s government announced last year that only electric two and three-wheel vehicles would be allowed by 2025.
    Bangalore-based startup Altigreen is among the companies looking to fill this space, as it prepares to hit the market with its debut three wheeler. ”
    https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/25/energy/altigreen-india-electric-rickshaw-spc-intl/index.html

    “Mahindra introduces Treo, a revolutionary new range of electric three wheelers. Powered by the most advanced Lithium-ion technology, Mahindra Treo will change the world of three wheelers forever. ”
    https://www.mahindraelectric.com/vehicles/treo-electric-auto/

    For clarification, no this not save the world.

    1. It won’t save the world, but cutting India’s massive oil import bill isn’t bad. India has more solar than it can ever use.

      1. https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/covid-isn-t-why-trump-losing-seniors-support-it-isn-ncna1242672

        I have been pointing out for quite some time that demographics are destiny, and that trump/ republican voters are old and that a hell of a lot of them will be gone within another two or three election cycles.

        And while I have been seeing some stuff occasionally about how older voters are turning against trump and his homies, I didn’t realize just how good things are looking in this respect.

  4. An interesting question is what proportion of the climate change is due to CO2?
    The amount of CO2 in the atmosphere has increased by 0.0124% between the years 1900-2020.
    Year 1900 296ppm = 0.0296%.
    Year 2020 420ppm = 0.042%.

    1. Tom,

      No the percentage increase is 420/296 minus one times 100=41.9% for atmospheric CO2 from 1900 to 2020. The last time the Earth’s atmospheric CO2 was as high as 2020 was the mid-Pliocene, approximately 3 million years ago. For most of the past 11,000 years (prior to 1750 CE) atmospheric CO2 for planet earth was 280 ppm or less.

      1. Hickory, you have right about the CO2 have increased by 34,2%.
        But the CO2 level in the atmosphere are 420ppm = 0.042% year 2020.

        In the atmosphere CO2 level have increased from 0.0296% year 1900 to 0.042% year 2020.

        Which Gases Make Up Earth’s Atmosphere:
        Nitrogen 78%.
        Oxygen 21%
        1% The rest of all gases (i.e., argon, neon, helium, hydrogen, and xenon),
        (i.e., water vapor, carbon dioxide, methane, nitrous oxide, ozone, and chlorofluorocarbons)
        http://www.ces.fau.edu/nasa/module-2/atmosphere/earth.php

        1. Tom –

          Since oxygen and nitrogen are not greenhouse gases (being transparent to infrared light), they are not relevant to a discussion of global warming. I presume you are not implying that since nitrogen and oxygen comprise the bulk of Earth’s atmosphere the effect of CO2 etc. are negligible (owing to their small percentage content of atmospheric gas). If you are, you have no place commenting on this Blog.

          BTW: Water vapor is the most abundant greenhouse gas. Humans have only a small direct influence on atmospheric concentrations of water vapor, primarily through irrigation and deforestation. Warming caused by human production of other greenhouse gases, however, leads to an increase in atmospheric water vapor because warmer temperatures make it easier for water to evaporate and stay in the air in vapor form. This creates a positive “feedback loop” leading to more warming.

          1. When ice melts, is it because of direct sunlight, warm air or warm water?
            Does ice melts slower in shadow?
            When ice builds up, is it because absence of direct sunlight, cold air or cold water?

            The most of CO2 is naturally in the ocean:
            The oceans contain 37,400 GT CO2.
            Land biomass has 2000-3000 GT.
            The atmosphere contains 720 billion tons of CO2.
            Humans contribute only 6 GT additional load on this balance.
            https://www.skepticalscience.com/human-co2-smaller-than-natural-emissions-intermediate.htm

            It´s impossible to stop Saudi Arabia, Iran, Iraq, Russia, USA, Mexico, Venezuela etc. from selling gas and crude.
            Humans survive CO2.
            Humans can´t survive without crude.

            1. Obviously when Homo Habilis first arrived on the scene about two million years ago it was as a result of crudity.

              The Egyptians, Greeks and Romans civilizations are considered, by many historians to be crude jokes.

              The British Empire ruled the waves for hundreds of years because they used some form of crudescence to calk their ships.

              Modern Americans are, in my opinion, addicted to crude. That’s how we managed to go from barbarity to decadence without passing through civilization.

          2. I have read an article that says Oxygen and Nitrogen are important greenhouse gases.
            Is this article faulty?

            Scientists: Oxygen & Nitrogen ‘Radiatively Important’ Greenhouse Gases With IR Absorption Temps Similar To CO2:
            They assert N2 and O2 are “radiatively important” “natural greenhouse gases” primarily because their concentration is “about 2000 (550) times higher than that of CO2 and about 4.4 × 105 (1.2 × 105) times more abundant than CH4.”

            Nitrogen, oxygen combined are more potent GHGs than methane
            The atmospheric abundance of N2 and O2 compensates for their relatively weaker IR function (when directly compared to CH4).

            For example, “the natural greenhouse effect of N2 and O2 would be larger than that of CH4 by a factor of 1.3” when considering their combined isolated GHE influence.

            Further, the reduction in the atmosphere’s infrared transmission amounts to 25.7% for N2, 14.2% for O2, and only 6.9% for CH4.
            https://notrickszone.com/2020/02/10/scientists-oxygen-nitrogen-radiatively-important-greenhouse-gases-with-ir-absorption-temps-similar-to-co2/

            1. Tom,

              The atmospheric amounts of nitrogen and oxygen aren’t changing; the amount of CO2 is increasing and has been at an increasing rate. So is the amount of methane. N2O too.

              Any greenhouse effect from nitrogen and oxygen is the background–it isn’t changing–to the increases in CO2 and methane and N2O. The greenhouse gases that are increasing in amount are the ones causing worry in connection to the global temperature change.

            2. Synapsid,
              Which proportions of the global warming depend on the different greenhouse gases?

              CO2 has increased 41,2%. From 283 to 411 ppm. From year 1900 to year 2020.

              CH4 has increased 116,5%. From 863 to 1873,3 ppb. From year 1900 to year 2020.
              https://www.methanelevels.org/

            3. Tom, you’re regurgitating ‘facts’ from climate change denial sites, and then it seems like you’re just posting them to try to get a reaction.

              I think you probably know more than you pretend, and i think you know enough about climate change and chemistry to know that what you’re posting is ridiculous.

              If you really are interested, you need to do some basic work, and learn a little about the subject. Google is your friend here.

              I’d suggest looking at NASA, NOAA, and other reputable sites. You can check the science organizations in your own country.

              Climate change and the effect of greenhouse gases is not new. The fundamental science behind it has been developed over 200 years. Quoting factlets out-of-context and pretending that you have some interest in whether the science is wrong is just bogus.

              You can do better than this.

            4. There is something wrong.
              Can anyone explain?
              I have been watching the Arctic ice sheet for several years at the National Data & ice data center.
              NSIDC receives the images from NASA.
              When I look at the arctic icesheet, the decreasing ice cover is not evenly decreasing?
              The ice cover decreases significantly more at the Russian border than the part bordering the United States.
              Is there more CO2 in Siberia than in Alaska?
              https://nsidc.org/arcticseaicenews/

            5. Ha! Ha! Tom!

              Yes, i suppose it is possible that you’re 12 years old, but I think you only sound that way, and i suspect you’re probably older than that.

              Maybe you should put your big-boy pants on, and leave your mother’s basement, and go out in the sunny weather and take a big, deep breathe. Get some oxygen into those brain cells! You can do it!

              You may not have much of a future in science or technical subjects, but your Mother might suggest other careers you can investigate. You know the hard little plastic things on the end of your shoelaces? Somebody has to put those on, and with training and if you work really, really hard, it could be you!

              Good luck, Tom. Get that oxygen! It can only help!

            6. Tank you all for your great answers.
              I was so worried it could be something else than CO2 that melts the Russian arctic ice.
              As Russias 100 nuclear powered military vessels in Russian arctic.
              Or Russias floating nuclear power stations in Russian arctic.
              Or Russias nuclear driven ice breakers in Russian arctic.
              Or Russias massive gas plants in Russian arctic.

              Lloyd’s Register shows about 200 nuclear reactors at sea, and that some 700 have been used at sea since the 1950s. Other sources quote 108 reactors in US naval vessels in mid-2019. More than 12,000 reactor years of nuclear marine operation have been accumulated, and Russia claims 7000 of these.
              https://www.world-nuclear.org/information-library/non-power-nuclear-applications/transport/nuclear-powered-ships.aspx

              Uses of nuclear-powered icebreakers
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear-powered_icebreaker
              Youtube:
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6G9B1fyqV4g

              Russian floating nuclear power stations
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_floating_nuclear_power_station
              Youtube:
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNHakxLO9eY

              See Russia’s massive new gas plant on the Arctic coast
              https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/2019/03/sabetta-yamal-largest-gas-field/

              Now i know. It´s only the rising CO2 level that melts the Russian arctic ice.

            7. Breathe Tom! Breathe! Put down the weed, at least for a little while.

              Suck that oxygen in. Feel it!

            8. Tom. This site has a little ignore button that allows the user to permanently disappear all comments by a particular person.
              I have used this sparingly, for people have have nothing to add to the conversation, other than dribble. You join CM and a few others on that list.
              I wish you mental clarity and that a bit truth may filter in.
              Adios.

        2. That’s just a nonsensical distraction. You aren’t saying anything, just throwing out red herrings. The quantity of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere is well known, as is its ability to absorb various wavelengths of light. So its effect as a greenhouse gas can be calculated.

        3. Tom. Please don’t pretend that we here are stupid. Clearly numbers are a tough subject for you, and based on your comments I suspect anything ‘science’ is too.

          It would be entertaining to see you and the trump ‘acting’ president to debate science and math issues.
          I’d have a hard time deciding on who to bet on.
          I guess I’d bet a penny on you, over him.

        4. Tom,

          That 21% of the atmosphere that’s oxygen is there because of photosynthesis and animal life on the planet depends on it, and photosynthesis depends on that small percentage of CO2.

          A small percentage doesn’t mean unimportant.

      2. CO2 is a mix of carbon and oxygen. Those are both natural, life giving minerals. We are all made up of carbon and oxygen elements in various forms. Now you know why I don’t feel personally threatened by climate change.

        1. Potassium, Carbon, and Nitrogen are all natural, life-giving elements. We are all made up of potassium, carbon, and nitrogen elements in various forms. Now you know why I don’t feel personally threatened by Potassium Cyanide? /s

        2. Carbon monoxide is a mix of carbon and oxygen, both natural life giving minerals; we are all made up of carbon and oxygen elements in various forms. So, why don’t you breath some CO, and the sooner the better. BTW oxygen isn’t a mineral. You are a fucking idiot.

        3. Ron, I like to add ,but there is nothing too add , you put it so very good and clear .

        4. Tony, that is one of the dumbest things I have ever read. Carbon Monoxide (CO) is also a mixture of carbon and oxygen, both life-giving elements. So just run a hose from car exhaust into your car. Roll the windows up and just soak in that life-giving mixture.

          But what could we expect from someone who thinks oxygen is a mineral.

          1. Ron, could not have explained it better . A little knowledge is dangerous .

        5. Sharks are naturally occurring creatures, that’s why it has been proven that they can’t hurt you…./s

          Tony and Tom must be graduates of the now bankrupt and disbarred Trump Univ.

        6. TonyMax and everyone,

          This is pure Dunning-Kruger. I apologize for even trying reason.

    3. I have seen many people say that CO2 can´t have influence in climate because “less than 0.1% is insignificant”.

      I suggest this people pour 84 mg of Potassium Cyanide in a glass of water (that´s 420 ppm) and drink it.

      1. Mcremp , I am with you on this . I worry more about the arctic ice situation than CO2 . Why ? This could disrupt agriculture . In Belgium this year the crops have been destroyed due to unseasonal high rains and winds of + 100 Km/ph on days . Suggest you watch videos from Prof Paul Beckwith on this matter .

        1. HiH, CO2 is the immediate cause. Arctic ice loss is an effect. Fair enough you worry about an effect, but never lose sight of the causes of that effect. The best way to reduce ice loss (and minor consequence like shut down of ocean circulation and the catastrophic chilling of Europe) is to reduce emissions of greenhouse gasses while letting huge areas of former forest land revert to forest again to draw down CO2 levels. Etc…

          1. The CO2 level is now at a record high and it is causing the Arctic ice loss.
            Why is the Antarctic sea ice extent now well above the median extent?

            “Antarctic sea ice extent may have reached its maximum of 18.95 million square kilometers (7.32 million square miles) on September 28, but the extent could still expand in the coming days. As is typical this time of year, there are wide swings caused by winds and storms along the extensive ice edge. Ice extent is now well above the 1981 to 2020 median extent.”

            1. Tom, I think your mother is calling you!

              The answers to all of your questions is just a little Google away! Go for it!

              Remember…. deep breaths.

            2. Tom, your behavior suggests that you might be a silicon-based life form, and your conversation skills limited to pre-packaged talking points.

              That’s more interesting than being a poorly educated carbon-based life form. In fact, i have a brother-in-law that i would happily trade for a low maintenance silicon creature. Are you interested in a new job?

  5. Jacking The Fear Porn; Prodding The Sheeple

    Continued from here…

    Why no-one can ever recover from COVID-19 in England – a statistical anomaly
    The Centre for Evidence-Based Medicine, July 16, 2020

    “People living in England have become increasingly concerned in the face of Public Health England’s (PHE) figures demonstrating a relentless daily toll of more than a hundred COVID-associated deaths several days a week…

    This is in stark contrast to the more reassuring recovery in neighbouring regions (Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland), where there are days with no COVID-associated deaths whatsoever.

    One reason for this due is a statistical flaw in the way that PHE compiles ‘out of hospital’ deaths data, rather than any genuine difference between the regions of the UK:

    …it seems that PHE regularly looks for people on the NHS database who have ever tested positive, and simply checks to see if they are still alive or not. PHE does not appear to consider how long ago the COVID test result was, nor whether the person has been successfully treated in hospital and discharged to the community. Anyone who has tested COVID positive but subsequently died at a later date of any cause will be included on the PHE COVID death figures.

    By this PHE definition, no one with COVID in England is allowed to ever recover from their illness. A patient who has tested positive, but successfully treated and discharged from hospital, will still be counted as a COVID death even if they had a heart attack or were run over by a bus three months later…

    In summary, PHE’s definition of the daily death figures means that everyone who has ever had COVID at any time must die with COVID too. So, the COVID death toll in Britain up to July 2020 will eventually exceed 290k, if the follow-up of every test-positive patient is of long enough duration.”

    Is Scotland overcounting the number of patients in hospital beds?

    “According to Scottish government’s Coronavirus (COVID-19) definitions, the number of patients in hospital with suspected COVID-19 ‘may include people who are in hospital for other reasons but have previously tested positive for COVID-19.’ While a count of new admissions to hospital only includes those who ‘tested positive for COVID-19 in the 14 days prior to admission to hospital, on the day of their admission, or during their stay in hospital’, no equivalent cutoff appears to be made for this count of individuals currently in hospital…

    This is similar to the problem with the PHE issue with deaths in England, which meant previously that everyone who has ever had COVID at any time must die with COVID too. The reason for the disparity in the Scottish data is not clear.

    The problem matches the pattern of poor quality data whereby COVID analyses have overestimated the true extent of the problems. It is, therefore, essential that we have data that we can trust, data that is verifiable and reported in the same way across the devolved nations to permit comparisons.”

    When is Covid, Covid?

    “We are constantly following the tally of Covid-19 cases. But one question won’t go away: when is Covid-19 actually Covid-19?

    Disease control agencies and the World Health Organisation have produced guidance for diagnosing Covid-19. We looked up case definitions*, and copied them into a table… to compare them.

    WHO

    …A confirmed case is ‘A person with laboratory confirmation of COVID-19 infection, irrespective of clinical signs and symptoms.’

    Thus, a positive laboratory test – type of test not specified here – trumps all else. We were not able to find WHO guidance on how PCR tests should be interpreted, specifically in relation to cycle count or viral load.

    European Union

    For the European Centers for Disease Control (ECDC), a case may be defined from clinical symptoms, or from radiology, or from ‘detection of SARS-CoV-2 nucleic acid in a clinical specimen’ alone…

    Confirmed in ‘any person meeting the laboratory criteria’.

    So, again, a positive laboratory test is more important than clinical diagnoses, and again, we were unable to find guidance on how laboratory tests should be applied and interpreted, particularly in PCR in relation to cycle count and viral load.

    USA

    The US Centers for Disease Control (CDC) states

    …No information is given on interpreting PCR tests in relation to cycle count thresholds or viral load. Again, it looks as though a PCR test trumps clinical diagnoses…

    The definition of suspected cases resembles what we would normally expect for making a diagnosis based on a set of clinical criteria. This is, however, discarded when it comes to a confirmatory diagnosis and replaced by a single PCR test result. However, there is no guidance providing details on the specific RNA sequences required by testing, a threshold for the test result and the need for confirmatory testing. It is therefore not clear to us what constitutes a positive result.

    Currently, any person meeting the laboratory criteria is a confirmed case. Yet, a case definition should be a set of standard criteria for classifying whether a person has a certain disease, syndrome, or other health condition (Centers for Disease Control and Prevention)…

    As a disease, the COVID-19 case definition should constitute a disorder that produces a specific set of symptoms and signs. The in-hospital case definition should, therefore, record the CT lung findings and associated blood tests.

    Only when an international standard is agreed upon will we be able to make comparisons, and answer the question of when is Covid, Covid?.”

    ————

    “If we can’t trust them more than a cabal of German lawyers we might as well give up on the concept of civilization.” ~ jjhman

    1. England changed its reporting of COVID deaths to match the rest of the UK a month ago. Now, only people who tested positive for COVID in the preceeding 28 days are included in official figures. Best estimate is that this now UNDER reports deaths, based on comparison with national excess death figures. It is quite common for a patient to remain in intensive care for more than a month before dying, but not to receive a repeat COVID test because they are evidently still suffering from the disease. Official England deaths were retrospectively reduced by 20,000 when this change was brought in.
      I live in the south of England were the infection rate remains moderately low, although increasing, In the last couple of weeks anxiety and general precautious behaviour has been rising noticeably as the infection rate has risen, especially amongst older people who have mostly known at least one person who died with the virus.

      1. Vitamin D levels should be falling across the UK population because, the angle of the sun is such that no vitamin D can be made in the skin from sun exposure even at mid day. There is mounting evidence that adequate levels of vitamin D in the blood reduce the chances of contracting COVID-19 and if it is contracted, reduce the likelihood of the disease overwhelming the immune system and causing long term lung damage or death.

        That is why a group of scientists have come together to advocate the the recommended daily allowance be raised by a factor of ten, to 4,000 IU per day. It has been established that even 2,000IU per day is insufficient to raise the levels to the level required for the vitamin to be effective in protecting from viral infections. The level of 4,000 IU is regarded as safe for all adults with both Dr. Anthony Fauci and vitamin D researcher Prof. Michael F Holick taking 6,000 IU daily and 10,000 IU per day considered the upper limit for absolute safety.

        There does not appear to be a whole lot of interest in this extremely affordable prophylactic. The main thing driving my interest in this is a recent clinical trial involving 76 patients that presented to hospital in Spain suffering from COVID-19. 50 were given doses of activated vitamin D and 26 received a placebo. Of the 50 that received the treatment, 1 was admitted to the ICU and all recovered. Of the 26 in the control group, 13 were admitted to the ICU and 2 died. That certainly warrants further investigation and in the meantime, the levels advocated by the scientists are totally harmless (no side effects whatsoever). I provided the links to all the details in the previous non-petroleum thread thread, just in case anybody missed it.

        To each his own

        1. “Vitamin D levels should be falling across the UK population because, the angle of the sun is such that no vitamin D can be made in the skin from sun exposure even at mid day.”

          Guess what Islandboy? A large majority living close to the Arctic Circle in Sweden have adequate D3 levels even during the second half of the dark winter. Furthermore, at least among ethnic Norwegian men and women who participated in a major population-based Oslo Health Study, the majority had sufficient vitamin D status.

          It is now almost 100 years since Sir Edward Mellanby demonstrated that cod liver oil would prevent rickets. Since this discovery, rickets due to vitamin D deficiency, once a serious pediatric problem in temperate climates, has become a rare clinical entity throughout the civilized world. Could that be the reason my Mum always gave me a spoonful of cod liver oil on cold winter nights? Even my wife, a Norwegian, was programmed to the daily dose of the horrible tasting oil. BTW many foods are fortified with vitamin D, like some dairy products, orange juice, soy milk, and cereals.

          1. How odd that people argue when, in fact, they’re in agreement.

            In this case you and Islandboy are in agreement that Vitamin D supplementation is a good idea…

      2. Fair enough, Ralph, and thanks for the updates.
        I wonder if, how or how well the general legacy MSM and others spun this (and spin this sort of thing) and if it got the proverbial burial in some obscure footnote, page or sound-bite that many, who may have done better for it, may not have noticed.
        In any case, it’s the tip of the iceberg and with this happening in a Western/developed country, and with outfits like the Centers For Disease Control or WHO.

        “The ‘iron law of oligarchy’ states that all forms of organization, regardless of how democratic they may be at the start, will eventually and inevitably develop oligarchic tendencies, thus making true democracy practically and theoretically impossible, especially in large groups and complex organizations. The relative structural fluidity in a small-scale democracy succumbs to ‘social viscosity’ in a large-scale organization. According to the ‘iron law’, democracy and large-scale organization are incompatible.” ~ Wikipedia

        1. You really hate democracy don’t you. You’ll do anything to discredit it.

          1. Anarchy As An Intellectual ‘Event Horizon’

            Theory of Anarchy

            “The problem of democracy is the problem of power–how to keep power decentralized, equally distributed, fairly shared. Anarchism means maximum democracy: the maximum possible dispersal of political power, economic power and force–military power. An anarchist society consists of a voluntary association of self-reliant, self-supporting, autonomous communities. The anarchist community would consist (as it did in preagricultural and preindustrial times) of a voluntary association of free and independent families, self-reliant and self-supporting but bound by kinship ties and a tradition of mutual aid.” ~ Edward Abbey

            ——

            Many people’s rationality seems to come to a halt on the doorstep of anarchy. They don’t want to enter, or are somehow incapable of entering, its building, like there’s a force-field around it or something, or like the ‘event horizon’ of a black hole.

            2. Why Anarchism is Dangerous

              “Anarchists frighten privileged elites and their authoritarian followers not simply because the primary goals of the movement have been to abolish the sources of elite power – the state, patriarchy, and capitalism – but because anarchism offers a viable alternative form of social and political organization grounded in workplace collectives, neighborhood assemblies, bottom-up federations, child-centered free schools, and a variety of cultural organizations operating on the basis of cooperation, solidarity, mutual aid, and direct, participatory democracy…

              Despite the current administration’s demonization, today’s anarchists work toward creating a free society not merely through militant street demonstrations, but by engaging in workplace organizing, mutual aid projects, and the creation of democratic organizations and counter-institutions…

              A directly democratic society principally opposed to domination and exploitation is some of what anarchism offers and why it is so dangerous to established power. “

              ——

              See also, here.

        2. All vertical organizations eventually become oligarchic, by nature.
          One needs horizontal organizations to maintain fluidity and small scale.

          1. The quote doesn’t say vertical though, just ‘all forms of organization’, ‘especially in large groups and complex organizations’. But I guess they can end up vertical and that, yes, small scale and simple would appear to be key.
            How to do it without running into paradoxes, though. ‘u^

  6. Talking about Turkey . How come Erdogan is able to fight 4 wars in Syria, Libya ,Greece and Azerbaijan when the Turkish economy is in doldrums . The Turkish lira is down almost 28% and tourism a major source is dead . Wars cost money and that is mainly dollars ,not Turkish Lira . Is it behind the curtain Nato operation to keep Putin occupied ?

  7. Astronomers capture exact moment supermassive black hole DEVOURED entire star

    “The flare itself is the result of almost unfathomable gravitational and frictional forces within the strands of cosmic spaghetti, which is made up of material from the soon-to-be-extinct star. The process is so intense, in fact, that at certain points, the TDE event outshines its host galaxy for a time before slowly fading over time until there’s nothing left.

    Based on their observations, the researchers determined the star was at one point roughly the same mass as our own Sun, and lost half of its mass to the black hole which is approximately a million times more massive.

    Observations of the TDE finally provided direct evidence for the outflowing of gas during these events, which had long been theorized and debated but never observed. In fact, researchers now know that, at least in this case, the black hole launched powerful jets of dust outward at velocities up to 10,000 km/s as it was eating the star.”

  8. My response to the HOH threadjack in the GOM thread:

    >We must understand that services support manufacturing . A decline in manufacturing will lead to a corresponding decline in tech services .

    Software and compact electronics is replacing manufacturing. Check my previous posts for long lists of replacements for ICE components with cheaper, simpler, lighter-weight electronic doodads.

    >our industrial civilisation is a three legged stool

    We use lots of energy and raw materials because modern technology is primitive, or because current pricing allows it. Also recycling massively reduces demand for primary production, but isn’t always used. Demand for raw materials is growing much less than is commonly supposed.

    CCD cameras almost killed demand for silver for film, previously its primary industrial use. Silver and gold are mostly produced so nouveau riche Asians can hide it under their beds.

    Demand for “graphic” paper (for printing) has collapsed in the last ten years in rich countries. Despite economic growth demand is flat elsewhere as ebooks, paperless offices and online news take over. Europe already recycles over 70% of its paper. That is used for the growing tissue and packaging market, and recycling is spreading. Why? because it is cheaper than primary production.

    Bauxite (aluminum ore) demand is flat and not expected to grow at all, despite growing demand for aluminum. This rift is caused by increased recycling, which is vastly cheaper than refining.

    Iron ore production is also nearly flat despite growing steel production, thanks to increased use of scrap iron as a feedstock. Only specialty steels really require iron ore, and the list is steadily shrinking. They made a bundle here in Duisburg on specialty steel for seamless steel tubing for the insanely wasteful fracking industry, but those days may be over, leaving those magnificent tubes scattered all over hell.

    Lead demand is growing, but recycling has kept primary production flat. Lead acid batteries are about three quarters of demand, and easy to recycle. That is set to fall as car demand flattens and companies switch to from 12V lead acid 48V lithium to reduce the size of wires in vehicles. Higher voltage and less current means less copper.

    Copper production will probably peak in a year or two, because low prices are killing new mining projects — copper ore isn’t worth digging. This is at least as exciting as peak oil.

    Nickel demand and primary output is growing. Lithium demand is also growing, but the quantities involved are very small compared to other metals.

    Though primary energy consumption has continued to grow, energy intensity has fallen by about 30% since 1990 worldwide. Will falling energy intensity lead to reduced consumption? EVs may be a tipping point, because they reduce primary energy consumption in vehicles by 80% or so. New coal and gas plants are much more efficient. New coal plants are above 45%, as opposed to the traditional 35%, and combined cycle gas plants often double the efficiency of older thermal gas.

    Also nuclear power plants produce vast amounts of waste heat, but they are slowly dying. This may not be great for the atmosphere, but it reduces the primary energy numbers as they are replaced by more efficient generators.

    We’ve probably already hit peak coal, though we will stay on a bumpy plateau for a few years. Big European and American utilities are jumping ship. China is building new plants but scrapping older, much dirtier and less efficient ones just as fast. Asian countries like Bangladesh and India, the promised land for coal miners just a few years ago, are rapidly abandoning plans for new coal fired power plants. Bangladesh just revised its forecast for coal fired plants in 2040 from 20GW to 7 GW. Those 7GW are already there or under construction.

  10. Ungovernable: An Interview with Lorenzo Kom’boa Ervin

    “We as activists, as organizers, have to make ourselves and our communities ungovernable. I know you’ve heard that term before. That means what it says. We have to make it so that we create a new kind of political system of our own, whether it’s dual power or revolutionary direct democracy, whatever we want to call it in this period. We need to create that kind of movement, a mass anti-fascist movement on one hand. And on the other hand, we need to have the capacity on a mass scale to build a community-based mass economic survival tendency, based on cooperatives in the ghetto for housing the poor, rebuilding the cities, and taking care of the material needs of the poor… what needs to happen is that we need to be reaching the masses of urban poor people with these programs. We’re not fighting just to have a cult or a group, or some leaders. We’re fighting to put power in the hands of the people in a new society. Presumably, revolutionaries know some things in some areas of organizing that people don’t know. So we need to be training them, we need to be equipping them to be independent of this political structure. I also think the Black Panther Party was right, we need to have survival programs and we need to be going beyond just what they had. We should be trying to build the survival economy in this period right now…

    So that’s why I said we have to build an alternative, radical force, so that it can then work in a way that it never has before to overthrow the entire system… In the final analysis, Trump may want a personal dictatorship. But the other guy [Biden], he’s an agent for the state and he’s an oppressor in his own right. He’s helped to get the prison system to the point where it is. His running mate, Kamala Harris,—well she is just as much of an establishment Democrat as he is. She’s just as much in favor of using the police and the government against the poor. We need to be able to educate masses of people about these things while we’re creating an alternative, so they will not be fooled. We need a new society and a new world, not more capitalism.”

    1. Since Trump, who is Putin’s bitch, is obviously going to lose the election, it has become urgent for you to do anything you can to discredit American democracy.

      1. I refuse to admit that Trump is going to lose the election. Just saying that gives lazy people an excuse to not vote, especially now when Republicans are doing everything possible to prevent Democrats from voting. We need to work constantly to help Biden win and win as big as possible including dragging the Senate along with him.

        1. “Democracy consists of choosing your dictators, after they’ve told you what you think it is you want to hear.” ~ Alan Coren

          “The oppressed are allowed once every few years to decide which particular representatives of the oppressing class are to represent and repress them.” ~ Karl Marx

          “Most people are not really free. They are confined by the niche in the world that they carve out for themselves. They limit themselves to fewer possibilities by the narrowness of their vision.” ~ V. S. Naipaul

        2. “We need to work constantly to help Biden win” ~ jjhman
          ——
          “But the other guy [Biden], he’s an agent for the state and he’s an oppressor in his own right. He’s helped to get the prison system to the point where it is. His running mate, Kamala Harris,—well she is just as much of an establishment Democrat as he is. She’s just as much in favor of using the police and the government against the poor.” ~ Lorenzo Kom’boa Ervin

      2. Inverted Totalitarian Cinema: Pass The Popcorn

        ‘American democracy’? Oh please. Since when?
        Since you were indoctrinated with it and it became your religion, via legacy state-corporate mainstream media’s flat manufactured imagery and cinema over your lifetime?

        Frankly, I wish I could take credit for discrediting American democracy, whatever that means, but the only finger I lift in that sense is in pointing to it discrediting itself, as if it ever had any credit to begin with.

        See also here.

        Highlight:

        Inverted Totalitarianism

        “The political philosopher Sheldon Wolin coined the term inverted totalitarianism in 2003 to describe what he saw as the emerging form of government of the United States. Wolin analysed the United States as increasingly turning into a managed democracy (similar to an illiberal democracy). He uses the term ‘inverted totalitarianism’ to draw attention to the totalitarian aspects of the American political system while emphasizing its differences from proper totalitarianism, such as Nazi and Stalinist regimes.

        The book Days of Destruction, Days of Revolt (2012) by Chris Hedges and Joe Sacco portrays inverted totalitarianism as a system where corporations have corrupted and subverted democracy and where economics bests politics.

        Every natural resource and living being is commodified and exploited by large corporations to the point of collapse as excess consumerism and sensationalism lull and manipulate the citizenry into surrendering their liberties and their participation in government.”

    1. The IEA still doesn’t get it. Based on current panel production capacity, total installed solar may double or more in the next four or five years. This is bad news indeed for anyone trying to make money selling fuel to generate electricity.

        1. Not that I know of. Holding ponds. Vulnerable holding ponds. Perhaps the deadliest places on earth. In your locale?

          1. Closest to here is Brown’s Ferry in AL. You can swim in the pools if you stay 3 meters from the rods. Get closer and ur are toast. If the water boils out it’s over for the regional biosphere.

Comments are closed.